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Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
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Attendance of 720,000 exceeds expectations
Submitted By bigdog on 09/06/17
FreeHovind, bigdog, General 
This Discussion originally posted in the "FreeHovind" Group


(June 10, 2009)

PETERSBURG, Ky. -- A school bus hissed to a stop near a giant concrete dinosaur perched outside the Creation Museum, a $27 million, 70,000-square-foot natural history museum-meets-Biblical theme park.



Three dozen middle school students tumbled out the doors, stretching after the 113-mile drive from Westside Christian School in Indianapolis for a field trip to augment their science lessons.

Inside, the students learned from displays that, contrary to mainstream textbooks, science supports the Bible's accounts of the Earth's creation in six days; that the Grand Canyon was created suddenly in Noah's flood; that dinosaurs and humans lived together; and that animal poison did not exist before Adam's original sin.

"Creation makes more sense -- what's here just confirms it," said seventh-grader Nick Johnson of Westside Christian.

Two years after its controversial opening, the Creation Museum has drawn 720,000 visitors, far more than the 250,000 annually organizers predicted. It brought in $7 million in receipts last fiscal year, with organizers saying it has had an economic impact of more than $20 million.

Along the way, it has become a popular science field trip destination for Christian schools, religious and home-school groups and public-school clubs. Students represent many of the museum's group visitors, which make up roughly 20 percent to 30 percent of overall attendance, officials said.

Several public schools have made the trip, museum officials said, declining to identify them. Some public-school religious clubs from as far as New Jersey have made the trip to a destination that continues to draw international media attention, partly because of the ongoing commemoration of Charles Darwin's 200th birthday.

Now, the museum is planning next year to expand its reach to young people, including a "Knee High Museum" of interactive displays and activities for young people. And it's increasing its reach by sending representatives to meet with teachers at religious schools and planning exhibits to counter Darwin's theory.

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"Children should be exposed to alterative views," said Mark Looy, a museum co-creator. "Where do you go to get an opposing view? To the Creation Museum."



Fear of pseudo-science
Scientists and secular educators fear those students are being led astray by pseudo-science that they say distorts accepted scientific findings, including a fossil record that shows life becoming progressively complex over billions of years. They also argue it fosters a distrust of science.

"The poor students who go there thinking they will learn some science are done a great disservice," said museum critic Lawrence Krauss, a physicist who directs the Origins Initiative at Arizona State University.

The National Center for Science Education asserts that "students who accept this material as scientifically valid are unlikely to succeed in science courses at the college level."

Yet religious schools are flocking to the museum, including schools from Louisville that view it as a valuable educational resource.

"It really helped supplement our curriculum" and "shed a lot of light" on earth sciences, said Dan Delaney, principal of Louisville's Northside Christian School, who objects to evolution "propaganda" in museums and textbooks.

That opinion is shared by Ann Shively, high school principal at Evangel Christian in Louisville. Shively said her school's visit last year confirmed "there's just too much fact and research that goes to prove that there's an intelligent design behind the universe."

The museum, which includes a digital planetarium, 150 exhibits and an effects theater, is the work of Answers in Genesis, a conservative religious group with a $24 million annual budget that is part of the "young Earth" creationist movement.

They believe that the Bible's book of Genesis literally depicts how the world was formed in six days.

As a result, they say that dinosaurs must have co-existed with humans and that the story of the flood and the ark are true.

Creator Ken Ham, who started the ministry in his native Australia and raised money to build the museum, says he uses "the same science" as evolutionists, but interprets it differently.

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Displays assert that genetics and archaeology had "confirmed" various Biblical stories and that complex human organs couldn't have evolved from simpler forms.



"Science tries to discredit God," said Della Davidson, a parent accompanying Westside's field trip with her 12-year-old daughter, Kyla. The museum "shows how God can discredit science."

Kentucky Department of Education spokeswoman Lisa Gross said nothing in state law would bar public schools from visiting, if it were part of "a lesson" on "how some perceived the world's beginnings."

Kentucky requirements
Kentucky does not require the teaching of evolution or creationism (or even science at all) in private schools. And public-school science teachers aren't prohibited from mentioning creationism, but lessons often include concepts behind evolution, Gross said.

Just last weekend, a New Jersey public-school history teacher who leads a religious club at Kearny High School took a bus full of students for a visit.

The teacher, David Paszkiewicz, gained national attention in 2006 for "telling students that dinosaurs were on Noah's ark -- things you shouldn't be saying as a public-school teacher," said Matt LaClair, a former student and member of the Ohio-based Secular Student Alliance, which complained about the recent field trip.

Kearny School District Superintendent Jacqueline Cusack said the school bus was paid for by the group, which had a right to go because it was an extracurricular activity.

Biologist Gene Kritsky, a professor at College of Mount St. Joseph in nearby Cincinnati, said he realizes that polls show almost half of Americans don't accept the evolutionary explanation and recognizes the right to believe in any view. But he worries the museum cloaks religion in science.

"The Bible is not a science book," he said. "In Job, it says that the Earth rests on pillars, but we don't teach that to children."

Reporter Chris Kenning can be reached at (502) 582-4697.
(rest of story with cool dinosaur video): http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20090610/NEWS01/906100383

» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
12 hours - 1,085v
Posted 2009/06/17 - 6:38 GMT
“"Creation makes more sense -- what's here just confirms it," said seventh-grader Nick Johnson of Westside Christian.”

Well, if Nick the seventh grader is sure of it then it must be true! He says it makes much more sense... but more than what? What is he comparing creationism to? Unless his school teaches subjects such as developmental embryology, genetic variation and geological analysis in the seventh grade, he doesn’t understand evolution. Neither do his classmates. The only reason it makes more sense to him is because creation is easy. It can be understood by twelve year olds.
And the museum cost $27 million?!?! There are people in third world countries that die because they can’t afford medication for curable diseases like TB. There are children that starve because their families are too poor to provide them with food. But where are the Christians putting their money? Towards making plastic dinosaurs and digital planetariums. I want you to ask yourself Bigdog: Is that what Jesus would do with 27 million dollars?
» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/06/17 - 7:36 GMT
why is he even posting this, it's just a copy paste article from their website,
POST SOMETHING ORINIGAL FOR ONCE.
somehting that actually metally chalanages us, instead of this mindless evangalical propoganda.
» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 19:49 GMT
Unless his school teaches subjects such as developmental embryology, genetic variation and geological analysis in the seventh grade, he doesn’t understand evolution.
 
For that matter, he probably hasn't even been taught the basic concepts of natural selection yet (unless things have changed drastically since my grade school days).
» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/06/17 - 7:45 GMT
"Children should be exposed to alterative views," said Mark Looy, a museum co-creator. "Where do you go to get an opposing view? To the Creation Museum."
 
and another view is PRACTICALLY ANY OTHER NON ABRAHAMIC RELIGION WITH A CREATION MYTH.
but they don't tell you that in bible class...DO THEY!?
 
"Fear of pseudo-science
Scientists and secular educators fear those students are being led astray by pseudo-science that they say distorts accepted scientific findings, including a fossil record that shows life becoming progressively complex over billions of years. They also argue it fosters a distrust of science."
 
it does when you teach THIS to illiterates and call it science.
 
"students who accept this material as scientifically valid are unlikely to succeed in science courses at the college level.""
 
i vouch that.
 
"Yet religious schools are flocking to the museum, including schools from Louisville that view it as a valuable educational resource."
 
i wonder why "RELIGIOUS" is in that scentence....
 
""the same science" as evolutionists, but interprets it differently."
 
that quote SHOULD be in double " because all he does is "complex, therefore god" "sedimentary layers? thererfore global flood" "aren't a a smart person".
 
""Science tries to discredit God," said Della Davidson, a parent accompanying Westside's field trip with her 12-year-old daughter, Kyla. The museum "shows how God can discredit science.""
 
right there is how you warp the view of science for your children.
 
 
» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 21:04 GMT
and another view is PRACTICALLY ANY OTHER NON ABRAHAMIC RELIGION WITH A CREATION MYTH.
but they don't tell you that in bible class...DO THEY!?
 
It would be amusing to see the fundie reaction if someone started a "teach the controversy" movement aimed at forcing religious education to include information on alternate viewpoints.
» Reply to Comment
In other news
10 hours - 500v
Posted 2009/06/17 - 13:00 GMT
In other news, a study commissioned by Ken Ham says that young people who attend church on regular basis are more likely to question the bible and leave.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
4 days - 5,621v
Posted 2009/06/18 - 3:58 GMT

It's true. It's because, I believe, we aren't really educating the kids in church about the truth and science of GOD's word. Then they go to school and get brain washed with our own money by science fiction (evolution) and seduced by the lusts of the world. In the last days the Bible says, "men will be lovers of pleasure rather then lovers of GOD."
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/06/18 - 14:41 GMT
dude, if you want to learn about science you go to school or colleage. If y ou want to learn about religion you go to church. There is no science nor absolute truths in church. Such claim is just pulled out of your ass.
Your religion wants to controll you. Tell you how to live and how to act and stop being human, be just another name in a population. It's for those who can't find any other meaning in their life. Atheism is for those who want to live their life to the fullest and recognice that we only have one life. Instead of preparing for the next life they accept the fact that there might not be another life and don't want to waste it.

School merly says that this it how it is in the real world, how you interpet it is your own responsability. A discussion of this doesn't alter the fact that no science is used in church.

Someone said (i can't remember who said it): "Read the damn bible! It's the easiest way to become an atheist if you're a rational person."
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
4 days - 5,621v
Posted 2009/06/18 - 22:52 GMT

Athiesm leads to communism. Talk about being controlled and just a number. Yikes!! It takes more faith to be an athiest. Complex life is impossible without a designer. Most people know, even the scientists that believe in evolution know this.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/06/19 - 9:01 GMT
"Athiesm leads to communism."
 
no it does not. the anti religious sentiment of russia had more to do with the mental slavery they wanted to be freed off.
 
Moa wasn't atheist, in fact Moa was inspired by Confusionism, a philosophy that does contain divine elements.
 
" Complex life is impossible without a designer."
 
OOOOh like we haven't heard that 1 before...
either you learn a bit about self replicating systems, or shut up.
 
"Most people know, even the scientists that believe in evolution know this."
 
aaah again with the "you secretly believe in god, but you're just afraid to say so" crap.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 21:00 GMT
either you learn a bit about self replicating systems, or shut up.
 
Sadly, it would appear that he's incapable of doing either one.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/06/19 - 15:11 GMT
"Athiesm leads to communism. Talk about being controlled and just a number. "
- Nice going talking from prejudice AGAIN! Atheism has as much with how the soviet was run like mustaches has with genocide.

"Complex life is impossible without a designer."
- "OMFG IT IS TO COMLPEX SO GOD MADE IT!!!!"
Still taling from ignorance and prejudice.

"Most people know, even the scientists that believe in evolution know this. "
- Ad populum, science isn't a democracy. We don't choose what we think is right. We don't vote on it. Good thing tho or we would have the large peice of the population that doesn't know shit ruling science. Just becuase it's a democracy doesn't mean the RIGHT or BEST candidate get elected.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 20:59 GMT
Athiesm leads to communism.
 
Since you failed to provide ANY substantiation of that claim, the only reasonable conclusion is that you're committing the "post hoc" fallacy (also known as "confusing correlation with cause").
 
It takes more faith to be an athiest.
 
I've asked you this before and you've dodged the question (as you probably will this time) - but, for the record: how does it require faith to have a lack of faith?
 
Complex life is impossible without a designer.
 
Reason being...? Or we're just supposed to take your word for it?
 
Most people know, even the scientists that believe in evolution know this.
 
Do you ever get tired of spewing unsubstantiated claims?
 
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/06/21 - 12:56 GMT
" how does it require faith to have a lack of faith?"
 
shouldn't that be phrased?
 
" how does it require faith to have a lack of faith in the existance a deity?"
 
 
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/21 - 20:14 GMT
Technically yes - although given that the topic was atheism, I would think that the "in the existance of a deity" part was implied by the first part of the sentence.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/06/22 - 10:45 GMT
"Technically yes - although given that the topic was atheism, I would think that the "in the existance of a deity" part was implied by the first part of the sentence."
 
ah ok, but i think it might have been wiser to give the question as complete as possible. you know, given the utter lack of understanding our "buddies" here have on answering questions...
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/22 - 16:23 GMT
ah ok, but i think it might have been wiser to give the question as complete as possible. you know, given the utter lack of understanding our "buddies" here have on answering questions...
 
I had put the more explicit version of the question to bigdog 2 or 3 times previously - so that this point, I didn't actually expect a response. It was really more of a rhetorical/"for the record" question.
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 20:52 GMT
Someone said (i can't remember who said it): "Read the damn bible! It's the easiest way to become an atheist if you're a rational person."
 
Nice. There's a variation I've heard:
 
"Christians are the leading cause of atheism."
» Reply to Comment
Re: In other news
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 21:36 GMT
"Christians are the leading cause of atheism."
- Yeah the thought was that any rational person reading it will find it absurd and not accept it.
» Reply to Comment
Re: Creation Museum's attendance exceeds expectations
3 days - 4,645v
Posted 2009/06/20 - 19:46 GMT
Thank you for providing further proof that Ken Miller was spot-on when he said (and I paraphrase from memory):
 
"Under the normal practice of science, there are many steps that an idea has to go through before it appears in a science text book. First, you propose a hypothesis, then you perform research to test that hypothesis, then you publish your ideas for peer review & defend or revise them in response to criticisms. And if your idea survives that gauntlet, you will gradually build consensus that your idea is correct - then (and only then) does it get included in grade school science text books.
 
But the advocates of creationism and intelligent design want to do an end-run around that process. They want to skip the whole research, peer review, and consensus steps - and go straight to the part where their ideas are included in text books. What it amounts to is that they want special treatment."


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