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Popcorn!
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Submitted By 9tails on 09/05/18
FreeHovind, 9tails, Creation and Evolution 
This Discussion originally posted in the "FreeHovind" Group

Just watching CSEtv and admiring Dr. Hovind's work. He really deserves a lot of respect and admiration for his knowledge and enthusiasm.
 
One thing I don't understand, Evolution is the most obvious pile of dodo I have ever heard of, and really respect people like Dr. Hovind for exposing it's garbage, Why do some people still follow it? What is it about Evolution that makes some people so billigerent and angry?
 
If you say "because creation is crap" or "evolution best fits the evidence" or something with that sentiment, when you understand the facts, you really cannot be helped. Best of luck to those closed minds.

5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 11:07 GMT
"Just watching CSEtv and admiring Dr. Hovind's work. He really deserves a lot of respect and admiration for his knowledge and enthusiasm."
 
you really are oblivious as to what AIG sais about him arent you....
or what scientific literate people say about him...
 
"respect the lying fraudster!"
 
"One thing I don't understand, Evolution is the most obvious pile of dodo I have ever heard of, and really respect people like Dr. Hovind for exposing it's garbage,"
 
hovind ofcourse strawmanning the crap out of science all day long....
please don't say you understand evolution, your posts have clearly show that you have no idea of what the theory is.
 
"Why do some people still follow it?'
same reason people follow atomic theory, or germ theory , or cell theory, ect.
 
and because what you think evolution is, isn't evolution at all.
 
"What is it about Evolution that makes some people so billigerent and angry?"
 
what is it about YEC that makes these people so gullable, incapable of critically thinking and hypocrits to the highest degree.
oh i know. their compolsive "reality must fit the bible".
 
hovind : lying about science, for jezus, al day long.
 
"If you say "because creation is crap" or "evolution best fits the evidence" or something with that sentiment, when you understand the facts, you really cannot be helped. Best of luck to those closed minds."
 
do i have to link the qualiasoup vid again? so that i can show, yet again, that you have no idea of what closemindedness is, and that you yourself are closeminded.
 
 
2 days - 3,026v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 12:04 GMT
325, I would like to reach you on a realistic basis. I notice that you Put in a regular amount of time in the forum. Being a creation science based website, petitioning Dr. Hovinds release, I consider your enthusiasm here. I really do respect your drive and ambition in the science fields.
 
From time to time I will make offensive posts, like "popcorn!" that drive at getting attention. I would like to make note that I do everything I do for a reason, there is a cause. This is not the only forum I frequent to "disturb the wasps nest", I go to a couple and have been banned from a couple.
One, http://www.evcforum.net/, I was banned from for "not following defined terminology".
 
You see, everything has a cause, a reason, a purpose, a drive. Every action, deed, word and thought have consequences, whether positive or negative. I always try to be cautious when living my life, for this very reason. And I wonder, what is it that drives you? I know that underneath the bitterness, anger and confusion there is suffering.
 
I have many friends that have different faiths then I do. Wiccan, pagan, druidism, deist, buddhist, islamic, judahism, etc. I have studied and talked with people about many beliefs.
 
One principle that unites everyone is suffering and death, that is our heritage. There are six paths of suffering that we struggle with. Brokenness, blindess, madness, bondage, sickness and hunger.
 
Even though I expect a different answer, remember this one thing. The spirit pursues you, in abundance, a large unique calling. One you cannot escape. It is that struggle that haunts you, it haunts your mind and body. It drives you to search, to hunger. Do not turn away from it, listen to it. It is what you know you must do.
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 12:47 GMT
"From time to time I will make offensive posts, like "popcorn!" that drive at getting attention. I would like to make note that I do everything I do for a reason, there is a cause. This is not the only forum I frequent to "disturb the wasps nest","
 
may this be because it's the only forum where there ARE bees to disturb?
 
"", I go to a couple and have been banned from a couple.
One, http://www.evcforum.net/, I was banned from for "not following defined terminology"."
 
which isn't suprising considering you keep using your own defenition of evolutio n EVERY single time you're trying to refute the theory.
 
"You see, everything has a cause, a reason, a purpose, a drive. Every action, deed, word and thought have consequences, whether positive or negative. I always try to be cautious when living my life, for this very reason."
 
and the evidenc that that is a magical sky daddy is???!
right. mthe bible. something most reational people wil ltake with a large grain of salt.
 
matter just has certain properties, why? i don't know for sure. i'll just "assume" they do as we can demonstrate these properties.
the origing for these properties is a niche where many theist have placed (a) god. which i have no problem with.
 
"And I wonder, what is it that drives you? I know that underneath the bitterness, anger and confusion there is suffering."
 
wow......
you really cannot understand the placement of text in relation to mood at typing do you?
i am not bitter, i am not even angry, im just horribly amused. and severly irriated that people like you still exist.
i';ll just ignore that your question is an obvious attempt to get at my consious, or that of the readers.
 
so i'll tell you why im here.
people like you are ignorant of science, and are geniusly delusional. not in the "WHA WHA crazy" sense, but in the irrational beleive in stuff that isn't there sense.
for every person like you, i hope there is one that is not beyond saving, someone who can actually learn about science and the human physche and realize everything for what it is.people who still have that little graps of rationality in themselves so that they can be reached by logic. people who might soemday use science to attribute to the future of mankind.
 
but that's only a side motivation. the real mostivation is.
science in science classes. and not religion in science classes.
if you're gonna make claims about you're position beign supported by science, you bet your ass i'll pull them apart to see if you're right. and if they're not. i'll let you know.
which is what i've been doing to you, bigdog and kent for the last few months.
i've told you this before.
 
"I have many friends that have different faiths then I do. Wiccan, pagan, druidism, deist, buddhist, islamic, judahism, etc. I have studied and talked with people about many beliefs."
 
i call BS! if you REALLY had friends of these different faiths, and if they had any science education, they would have pointed you to your flawed reasoning LONG ago.
i'm also suprised you didn't take the effort to put "atheists" in the list.
becasue by all the claims you make about atheists, it becomes damm clear you don't have anyone of those as friends.
 
"One principle that unites everyone is suffering and death"
survival trait.
 
"Even though I expect a different answer, remember this one thing. The spirit pursues you, in abundance, a large unique calling."
 
my "foster" parent tried that, they failed.
 
"One you cannot escape. It is that struggle that haunts you, it haunts your mind and body. It drives you to search, to hunger. Do not turn away from it, listen to it. It is what you know you must do."
 
YESSshh i SHOULD FEED ON HUMAN FLESH AND HAIL SATAN!!
...
no...i'll get serious now.
 
i've been to through the door of despair and i've been on the brink of death. i came back. on my own. with no god.
 
as much as i'd love to believe in a bigger destiny, as much as i'd like to fantasize about it, it's not there.
it never was.
 
i make my own destiny. i make my own meaning to life. i am not haunted. i am not afraid. i am happy. i am able to see things for what they are and i care that they aren't that rose coloured.
 
you're outreach has yet again....fallen in the water...
i've been over this before with you and bigdog. no matter how you try to appeal to my consious or emotions, i'll notice the tricks.
 
you're not taking ona  14 year old insecure teenager...i thought you'd have know that by now....
 
 
 
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 17:40 GMT
"i've been to through the door of despair and i've been on the brink of death. i came back. on my own. with no god.
 
as much as i'd love to believe in a bigger destiny, as much as i'd like to fantasize about it, it's not there.
it never was.
 
i make my own destiny. i make my own meaning to life. i am not haunted. i am not afraid. i am happy. i am able to see things for what they are and i care that they aren't that rose coloured."
- Been there, done that. When life strikes you down all you got is yourself. Our lifes is in our hands and life is not a dance on roses. People try to live in a dreamworld and think their life is greater than it is. If you see what it is for real, you don't have to have any religion. And in the end you find... genuine happiness.

- 9tails, srsly... If you think potholes videos is confusing then you got some issues. They are as informative and describing as possible and he gives sources with full article name. Not like Mr. Hovind who leaves that part out and rapidly switches subject so no one can think after about what he says.
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 14:01 GMT
"http://www.evcforum.net"
 
you know i can easily accept that you where banned for using wrong terminoligy. i've visited the site and dam, does that look better then this, so much more science....
 
i saw a seemingly intelligent ID creationist post something about IR eyes. but after 3 pages it became real clear he didn't know what the theory of evolution applies to and he was ingorant of the results of natural selection.
 
he was imply (re)postulating "so complex/ i don't understand, therefore god", making intelligent remakrs on the side, but refusing to acknowledge his fallacious reasoning, or his ignorance of the theory.
 
 
and the mods are stict with good reason.
if you're gonna ague, stay on topic. and look at the arguments provided, and refute them mwith substantiated rebuttals.
 
rick there got his ass served, by a CHRISTIAN no less.
but rick just said "i refuse to debate you because you're mean" and so the scientist was forced to say, "well then FU!"
 
2 days - 3,026v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 20:17 GMT
with no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no godwith no god
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 20:21 GMT
spam?
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 20:31 GMT
i think he got some kind of brainfail from his failing logic.
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 20:36 GMT
possibly his fiath-fuse burned out....i better call peter and tell him to send jezus to replace it...again...
3rd time this happened....those things are expensive you know...
666 hail mary's per pop....i just know freaking jaweh is ripping me of.....
 
:P
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/18 - 21:00 GMT
correction! Extra large brainfail than usually resulting in spastic ctrl + C  ctrl + V
11 hours - 938v
Posted 2009/05/19 - 22:57 GMT
I have tried real hard to understand all this, and wherever I go I am called closed minded stupid brainwashed etc etc so I mostly lurk. I agree with 9tails, and also respect Kent Hovind. I have recently actually watched some of his videos. He is very charismatic and charming. Most of the stuff he exposes is well know.
 
It is never ever going to be resolved either, as the opposite camps  on BOTH sides never get it. To us Creation is much more logical , and to evolutionists, evolution is.
 
For me I cannot understand that, as all I see is a trial of lies and stuuff that makes no sense at all.
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/20 - 6:03 GMT
"Most of the stuff he exposes is well know."
 
yes and most of it is well known to be falshoods and mischaraterizations.
 
" To us Creation is much more logical , and to evolutionists, evolution is."
 
THIS ALL COMES FROM THE simple fact that most creationists DO NOT understand what the theory applies too or what it even is.
 
really it's so frustrating to see people who question the theory without understanding it. it's aslo frustrating to see these people not understanding or wanting to understand the science behind it.
if you picked up a normal secular science textbook and you read the explination of natural selection working on mutations and how branching speciation and isolation leads to large varieties in genotype, IT BECOMES SO OBVIOUS WHAT THE THEORY STATES, and how it's so demonstrably true in it's explination.
 
now if you understood THAT, the next step for creationists is ID, which with some further understanding of the principal of natural selection can easily be explained by natural selction and god.
 
"For me I cannot understand that, as all I see is a trial of lies and stuuff that makes no sense at all."
 
on what camp? i can easily link to to a routine debunking of hovind's videos which will show you just how much YOUR camp is being fallacious. if you actually understood how the theory works. all this "stuff that makes no sense at all" will become obvious.
 
did you see some of the vids i linked? most of them explain evolution to you in bite sized chucks. i suggest you watch some by donexodus and cdk007.
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/20 - 13:55 GMT
"...respect Kent Hovind."
- Don't man, he does not earn any respect at all. This is the reason why:
http://www.noanswersingenesis.org.au/bartelt_dissertation_on_hovind_thesis.htm
It's the only Peer-review of Hovinds thesis by a REAL scientist. Take 30 and read that and nothing that comes from Hovind is good. All his videos he quotemines, does not state the name of the article he's quoteing and he flashes everything so fast you don't have any possebility think after on exactly what he said. Also he's never accepted a longer and deeper argument of his "info". There is so much wrong with that man i can't even write it all here.

"He is very charismatic and charming."
- Might be true, but then again as i stated above. There are so many flawes if you even bothered to look.

"Most of the stuff he exposes is well know."
- Nope, give us anything you think he exposes and we'll tell you everythign that is wrong with it and show you reliable sources from accredited universities. Also watch this on why his "exposures" are wrong: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbvMB57evy4

"To us Creation is much more logical ..."
- Nothing logical at all. The method of having the answer before searching for results and evidence for supporting it is so fallicious in every scientific way possible. = Creation is not a science, maybe pseudoscience.

"For me I cannot understand that, as all I see is a trial of lies and stuuff that makes no sense at all. "
- If you don't understand it you haven't tried to learn it. I bet you've got the "It's to complex for me to understand and so GOD DUNNIT!" , right? I'm sorry but i've read as much as possible from both sides and was really open to this, but creation has no answers to anything and it does not follow the scientific method. It's not like the scientists decided that the earth was 4.6 billion years old, it was what the evidence showed it to be.
2 days - 3,026v
Posted 2009/05/20 - 15:10 GMT
"if you actually understood how the theory works."
 
So you keep saying, fortunately I've studied evolution for so many years now and have yet to see any SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE for it.
 
Common ancestry - In the thousands of years of human recorded history (imagine that), No documentation has ever been found of one animal, undergoing any kind of physical transformation up to the animal presently.
 
Abiogenesis - In the thousands of years of recorded history, spontaneous generation has not ever been observed or documented on earth or elsewhere in observable space.
 
etc., so forth and so on.
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/20 - 15:45 GMT
"So you keep saying, fortunately I've studied evolution for so many years now and have yet to see any SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE for it."
- read the post about the missing link i posted in this forum.
You don't want to see any evidence and therefore it's impossible for us to show it even if we slammed it in your face. Did you study evolution and have a degree in this interseting subject?

"Common ancestry - In the thousands of years of human recorded history (imagine that), No documentation has ever been found of one animal, undergoing any kind of physical transformation up to the animal presently."
- Still shows you don't know what you're talking about. Evolution takes millions of years, not 6000. There are evidence for it. As i stated above, watch the post about the missing link. As it takes to so long time, we can't show you a exactly all variations of a species. The conditions of fossilisation is to bad for that. I find it ironically how much you desire a documentational evidence for common ancestry and yet you accept god as truth without requiring any evidence for his existance. We can never prove he exists as we cannot prove he had anything to do with how the world came to be.

"Abiogenesis - In the thousands of years of recorded history, spontaneous generation has not ever been observed or documented on earth or elsewhere in observable space."
- You do realise how much the earth has changed? and that the atmosphere has changed? The conditions that we got for so long time ago is only found in smoking cimneys in the deeps of the ocean.

You are so damn ignorant and refuse to see anything that does not comply with your world view and beliefs.
5 days - 8,142v
Posted 2009/05/20 - 16:20 GMT
"So you keep saying, fortunately I've studied evolution for so many years now and have yet to see any SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE for it."
 
then WHY DO YOU STILL MISCHARATARIZE THE THEORY BY USING HOVINDS DEFINITIONS?! INSTEAD OF THE DEFINITION SCIENCE ACCEPTS.
 
"Common ancestry - In the thousands of years of human recorded history (imagine that), No documentation has ever been found of one animal, undergoing any kind of physical transformation up to the animal presently."
 
2 reasons why that is bull.
 
1) we've only really been keeping track of this with a high level of scrutiny for the last few decades so no suprise. but we have still observed direct and indirect speciation. and once you got speciation, it's only  a matter of time.
 
2) the kind of "change" you are expecting occurs over MANY THOUSANDS OF GENERATIONS. so not suprising you don't witenss it in old texts from 6000 years ago.
 
3) interestinly enough there are many examples of HUMANS screwing around with selection criteria, how do you think we god household cats dogs, broccoli, banana's ect..
 
"Abiogenesis - In the thousands of years of recorded history, spontaneous generation has not ever been observed or documented on earth or elsewhere in observable space."
 
again this is so falacious it makes my head hurt.
 
1) again, this theory is only a few decades old, so no suprise. yet we still know a lot more now.
2) when did you think we were capable of witnissing polymers and DNA? hint* it wasn't 100 years ago.
3) abiogenesis IS NOT sponatnious generation. interestingly enough that theory was disproven and dropped more then a 100 years ago, by Pasteur.
4) all the organic chemicals have since been obsorbed by already living organisms, if we are gonna obesrve abiogenesis, it's gonna have to be in a lab. there's just to much alive competition out there now....with all the microbes and stuff.
 
"etc., so forth and so on."
 
huh? you didn't even know what you were talking about and yet you act like you do...funny.....
2 days - 2,415v
Posted 2009/05/23 - 2:13 GMT
"So you keep saying, fortunately I've studied evolution for so many years now and have yet to see any SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE for it."
- Reading about it on creationwiki and ICR articles doesn't make you qualified for it. If you read a book about how to win in poker games and the book doesn't take up anything usefull or utter BS you wouldn't be better at poker would you?


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